534: Getting Off The Spectrum: Jodie Meschuk’s Path to Helping Kids Overcome Autism, ADHD, Allergies, Heavy Metals, and Vaccine Injury

Is autism really a lifelong condition, or can it be reversed? In this episode of the Learn True Health podcast, Jodie Meschuk shares her powerful journey of helping her child recover from an autism diagnosis using holistic methods. She reveals how brain inflammation, heavy metal toxicity, and gut dysfunction are often misdiagnosed as autism—and how detox, nutrition, and natural healing can bring incredible results.

Jodie also exposes the flaws in conventional pediatric care, the hidden dangers of vaccines, and the importance of informed medical decisions. If you're looking for real answers and hope beyond mainstream medicine, this episode is a must-listen!

Highlights:

• Jodie Meschuk shares her journey of helping her child recover from an autism diagnosis through holistic healing.
• Autism is often misdiagnosed when the real issue is brain inflammation, heavy metal toxicity, and gut dysfunction.
• The rapid rise in autism rates suggests environmental and medical interventions, not genetics, are to blame.
• Vaccines contain harmful ingredients like aluminum and formaldehyde, which can contribute to neurological damage.
• Parents are often gaslighted by the medical system and not given informed consent about vaccine risks.
• Conventional pediatric care follows a rigid “standard of care” that prioritizes pharmaceutical solutions over holistic healing.
• Jodie emphasizes the importance of detoxing heavy metals, healing the gut, and strengthening the immune system.
• Natural healing methods, including dietary changes and detox protocols, helped her child regain speech, eye contact, and social skills.
• She advocates for parental empowerment, informed medical decisions, and questioning mainstream health narratives.
• The medical industry profits from chronic illness, making it crucial for parents to seek alternative healing approaches.

Intro:

Hello, True Health Seeker, and welcome to another exciting episode of the Learn True Health Podcast. Strap on your seat belt. Today’s going to be a bumpy ride. It's an amazing conversation. I'm so excited for you to hear today's episode.

Before we do, I want to let you know that if you are struggling with detoxing, especially heavy metals, I have some amazing interviews for you to listen to. Also, I have some amazing resources. You can go to learntruehealth.com, type in heavy metals. You can also type in vaccine or vaccines. Use the search function on my website, learntruehealth.com. You’ll find some really great interviews. Kellyann Andrews comes on several times, talking about heavy metal detox. I have Dr. Klinghardt on the show as well, a great heavy metal detox expert. He regularly takes children who are on the spectrum, gets them so healthy that they no longer are on the spectrum, and then we question whether that diagnosis was accurate in the first place.

This is one of the things that we discussed today, that so many children over the course of the last 34 years went from one in 10,000 kids being on the spectrum to one in 32, between 28 and 32. That’s not genetic. Something genetic doesn’t just, within four years, become that prolific. So we have to ask ourselves, what’s really going on? This discussion today answers that question.

As far as answers are concerned, there are so many holistic ways to support the body. It’s constantly trying to come back to homeostasis. That’s why I love some of the tools that I have. If you’d like to know some of the tools that work really well with my clients, with heavy metal detox, especially in myself personally—if you've been a long-time listener, you know that I struggle with heavy metal toxicity and I have overcome it using several different modalities—I’d love to share them with you.

Please feel free to book a free phone call with me. I want to talk to you. I love talking to the listeners, and we have so much fun on our phone calls. Just go to learntruehealth.com, in the menu, select Work with Ashley James, and it’s the very first thing that you click from there. It’s a free 20-minute or so phone call. Sometimes the phone calls go longer. If you have more questions, I will stay on the phone with you and answer them. We have a really great time.

I highly recommend the phototherapy patches that I've talked about on the show with Trina Hammack and David Schmidt. I’ve had clients use them successfully. We have a detox protocol, and it works so well because it increases the body's function to produce more glutathione. Within 24 hours, you will produce 300% more glutathione.

There’s actually a study out of South Korea with several patients of this doctor—I think it was 40 or 60 patients—who, over the course of 12 weeks, used this particular patch to increase their body's ability to create glutathione. What they found was a 75% improvement in their cognition, quality of life, and all their symptoms, and this was rated by the parents. So the parents saw this. Some children went from nonverbal to verbal, from not making eye contact to making eye contact and hugging, from rocking and holding themselves or being held against the wall to playing with the other kids.

This is wild, and this is just one of the many things that we can do naturally. It’s non-invasive, no negative side effects. There are gentle things that we can incorporate to support our body’s ability to heal itself. That’s why I’m so excited to introduce this to you.

If you are new to this world of holistic medicine, there are so many little things that we can add, and each one is profound. Together, they help us gain true health. As our guest today shares, she helped her child get off the spectrum.

Here’s the thing—is it truly autism, or is it heavy metal toxicity and damage from pesticides, from environmental pollutants, from the chemicals that are injected into us? So that’s the question—what’s going on?

If you’re here and you're listening because your child has been sick and has been socially poisoned by some form of chemicals out there, whether it’s injected or through food, we can support the body's ability to heal itself. That’s the exciting thing.

The power goes back to your court. We feel so powerless when we go to the MD and they write us prescriptions, and they just don’t have answers for us when it comes to chronic illness. They do not have the pathway to true health.

We have to take it upon ourselves to learn how to eat to heal our body, what we can do throughout our day to support our body. This is holistic lifestyle medicine. That’s what we’re here to teach you by listening to the Learn True Health Podcast.

So please sign up for a free phone call with me. I’d love to talk with you and share some of the resources that have made a huge impact on the thousands of clients that I’ve worked with over the last 13+ years.

I’m in this to help people and to help people get the true health that they deserve. So go to learntruehealth.com, sign up to talk with me. I’d love to help you. Use the search function on my website to search for the things that you are most interested in.

So go to learntruehealth.com, sign up to talk with me. I'd love to help you and use the search function on my website to search for the things that you're most interested in, because we have wonderful episodes. We have over 500 episodes, and so many of them offer real step-by-step activities that you can do today, that you can start doing today to immediately improve your health and to feel the improvement right away.

If you're not feeling full of energy, having great sleep, mental clarity, if you're not feeling amazing every day, then take on the challenge of listening to these episodes and doing the activities. Another thing you can do is get my book, because I have over 500 interviews in.

I wrote my book a few months ago and published it. It's called Addicted to Wellness. You can go to learntruehealth.com/addictedtowellness, and it's a compilation of the most effective steps, and it's done in challenge form. So you take on between one and four challenges a week, and you get to journal what you learn from it and how your body feels going through the process of these challenges.

It's an accumulation of the most important steps, the fundamental keys to true health, and if you're missing these, these are the pillars of health. If you're missing them and then going out for a prescription drug, your body is missing what it needs, and then we're just drugging ourselves.

I know you don't do that, but this is what a lot of people do and a lot of doctors do—we're missing the foundations of health. So please check out my book Addicted to Wellness. You can get it on Amazon or go to learntruehealth.com/addictedtowellness.

Sign up for a free chat with me. Love to chat with you, love to help you, and point you in the direction of some great resources. Use the search function on my website, learntruehealth.com, and find the specific episodes for the things you're really interested in so that you can start feeling amazing.

I've been on an amazing health journey. I've healed over five diseases, and that's why I do what I do—because I don't want you to suffer anymore. The needless suffering, needs to end. We're turning our health around as a nation and as a world.

Please share this episode with all those you care about so that we can turn this ripple into a tidal wave and help as many people as possible to learn true health.

Welcome to the Learn True Health podcast. I'm your host, Ashley James. This is Episode 534.

Ashley James (0:08:26.066)

I am so excited for today's guest. I have Jodie Meschuk, who is a board-certified naturopathic doctor, author, activist, coach, and just amazing, amazing. I love your story. I love that you are here to help parents navigate this crazy world when their child has an illness or has a diagnosis, is on a spectrum. Just pick a spectrum, any spectrum.

You are there to help and to navigate. I just interviewed a doctor yesterday. She's unfortunately more allopathic than I'm used to interviewing. She used the word need drugs when it came to something that wasn't like a life-saving thing. She said need drugs. I'm like, Hmm? and then I brought up herbs. I'm like, well, what about this, this, this, and that? What about these other options? This is how MDs, medical doctors, go through an indoctrination system throughout their college, throughout their university, and they're taught how to use drugs as their tools. They're not taught how to help the body get so healthy that it no longer has these symptoms or that it gets to the stage of absolute optimal health. They have not been taught that.

Now they have their place, obviously, emergency medicine, saving lives. When it comes to chronic illness, they are horrible, and their tools are horrible. Not they themselves are horrible, their tools are horrible. What they've been taught is horrible.

So I'm so excited to have you on the show today because you have an amazing track record of helping parents get their kids so healthy that they're no longer on spectrums. So welcome to the show.

Jodie Meschuk (0:10:16.547)

Thank you so much for having me. I'm excited to be here. Every day is a good day to just speak truth and give parents hope. As you mentioned with doctors in the system, or as I like to refer a lot of times to the system, kind of quote-unquote, the system is, it's very one-dimensional. You would think it would be the opposite of the way medicine was years and years ago with house calls, and you had one doctor who could handle many different things that were going on in the body because they looked at the body holistically. 

Unfortunately, now we are in a day and age where everything is compartmentalized, and you have 10 or 20 or 30 different specialists for different parts of the body, and nobody's speaking to each other. Anyways, all of that just creates a whole lot of, I think, paralyzation and confusion for parents, especially when you're dealing with maybe a new diagnosis that their child has received. 

I think also, we can look and just kind of call the elephant out in the room, which is that this autism epidemic and really the chronic illness epidemic in children that we see today, it doesn't have to be that way. There's actual truth behind what's really going on. But unfortunately, a lot of these parents just don't have a chance to hear that truth because everything is so censored or relying on the system. So you're relying on those doctors who aren't really looking at the body holistically. All that to say is I'm very passionate about this kind of topic because we have lived it, we've gone through it, we've seen the other side, and I just want to do everything in my power to help end this epidemic that we see happening today.

Ashley James (0:12:06.089)

Absolutely. I'd love for listeners to know why I found you, why I think you're so amazing is your story, your initial story about how you helped a child of yours to reverse a diagnosis. Would you care to share that story with us?

Jodie Meschuk (0:12:27.965)

Yes, absolutely. I will say the story has kind of, the way that I share it obviously has changed a little bit over the years because our children get older. There are things that we reflect on. There are things that we look at. I think that's just part of the process. But the foundation of that story, it's interesting because it still holds very true today. If you would have asked me 15 years ago,14 years ago, even 13 years ago when we were in the depths of this reversal and healing the body and just kind of reversing all the damage that had happened to my child, I would have thought that many years ago this would not still be an epidemic today but the sad part is that it still is, and it's actually getting worse.

So that's very alarming to me in terms of like how did we even get to this place as a society where, for example, with autism, you have this term that has just become this umbrella for basically inflammation happening in the brain and body. I think it's really important that we call things what they are, but what you're going to find is that when you take a new parent, or even when I go back to the beginning of my story with my own child, you have these symptoms and these things happening, but they want to just lump it into this label or this diagnosis to make you feel better. But it doesn't really make you feel better because all you want is for your child to be happy and healthy. So if I go back to when it first started for us, I was a new mom. It was my first child. As a new mom, you're trying to figure everything out, and you're trying to listen to the experts and have the best pediatrician and do really the best things that you can for your baby. 

I think if I look back when I was even just pregnant, you want the best for your child. So you go and you find all the things that are supposed to help your child be healthy. At the end of the day, the ironic part is our babies actually really don't need anything at all. They don't need these interventions or vaccines. They don't need a medicalized birth. They don't need the eye gel. They don't need all this stuff that has been basically shoved down our throats for years, that if you don't do these things for your child, your child is not going to be healthy.

I never realized that. As a new mom, I just trusted the system, and you're feared every step of the way that if you do not vaccinate your child, for some reason, your child is just going to die of measles. There's so much fear put into you. So that's really where I was caught, honestly. I was trying to do the best I could for my child.

I wanted them to be happy and healthy. But because of that blind trust that I had in the system, we ended up paying a really big price for that. So I can kind of take you back to the beginning if you want and sort of set up our story, which I think is probably very similar to what a lot of women go through, especially when you're looking at the medicalized birth system that we have in this country today. It's also in a lot of other countries.

Because a lot of things in the U.S. end up bleeding over into other countries as well. But it's very prominent here if you think about how people want convenience. They want quick fixes. They don't want to feel pain. So you have this medicalized birth system, and I'll kind of say, the first straw that sort of led up to the straw that broke the camel's back is when I was diagnosed with strep B. So a lot of women are diagnosed with strep B, which is a pretty normal bacteria that exists. Whether or not that actually causes problems, the data is not actually super clear on that. But of course, the standard of care is that you just get antibiotics, and that's it. That is literally the standard of care.

So when you're looking at the standard of care, that means there's no deviation. That's really important for mothers to understand, that standard of care is just all the system has been taught. It's their way of medicalizing everything. If you ask a question or if you try to see if there's another option or another way, you're often met with a lot of gaslighting, a lot of shaming. You're an irresponsible mother, an irresponsible parent.

So that was me. I was told I had to get antibiotics, which means that while I was delivering my child, they also got exposed to antibiotics. I had no idea the repercussions that would occur in my child's health with having an immediate exposure to antibiotics before they even entered this world. I think that was just really one of the first things that if I look back on, I go, what? That's such a simple thing to reverse. That's such a simple thing to look at differently, where you don't have to necessarily take those antibiotics if you don't want to. There's another path, but you're never given that choice. You're just told what to do, and you have to fall in line, or again, you get shamed, and you get all the nasty things said at you. So that was really the beginning of the birth. It's the epidural, it's the strep B, the antibiotics.

My amazing, healthy, beautiful baby is born, and it's the Hep B shot immediately within minutes. It's the eye gel. It's the Johnson & Johnson toxic baby wash on the skin. It's cutting the cord within seconds. It's all of this medicalization that, if you think about it, doesn't set up the baby for health. Your baby is not born deficient in hepatitis B vaccine. They're not born deficient in eye gel. They don't need that stuff. So I kind of went along with it. There was something inside of me that felt very uncomfortable, but because I didn't have my confidence at that time, I just didn't know how to speak up. I think again, what is often so ignored is the fear that they have sown in mothers for so long that you truly do not know how to even use your voice in a setting like that  because all they do is fear you, that something's going to happen if you don't do what they say. 

So that was kind of the beginning, which, basically again, looking back, I don't know that my child was necessarily set up for health at that point because they already had three or four assaults to their body. Every assault it takes time to come back from. Every assault could cause a domino effect in something else. I don't know that a lot of parents realize that hepatitis B vaccine is full of a chemical that affects the liver, which can cause jaundice and the kidneys too. So you think about all these babies that end up with jaundice, and there's an absolute connection between what is in that hepatitis B vaccine and how their baby is responding to that. But they're never told that. They're just told, well, that's normal. We'll just put them under some lights and we'll watch them instead of maybe they're having a reaction to that hepatitis B vaccine. So it gets ignored. It gets pushed under the rug.

Ashley James (0:21:12.048)

And they get to make more money because they get to do more interventions.

Jodie Meschuk (0:21:15.384)

Yes, absolutely. It's just all about the money. I mean, think about the amount of babies that end up in the NICU simply because they had a reaction to the hepatitis B vaccine, but now they're in the NICU. 

Ashley James (0:21:15.384)

Well, let's just pause the story to talk about this because you and I know the hepatitis B vaccine. So those who listen who have been told and believe, and I, at one point in my life, I was one of them. I just want to say I hate the term. Hate is a very strong word. I hate the term anti-vaxxer. I just want to be very clear. Everyone who is an anti-vaxxer was once a pro-vaxxer, and then they had the negative experiences, and then their eyes were opened.

So don't call anyone an anti-vaxxer. Call them an ex-vaxxer for a very good reason—because of the experiences we've had, but also because our eyes have been opened and we see the truth. Tell us about this particular vaccine they give a baby on their very first day within hours of being born. New baby, six, seven, eight pounds, and they give them this vaccine.

This vaccine, only a decade or so ago—maybe two decades ago, but I just remember it. I'm from Canada, so our schedule is a bit different, but I live in the States now. I remember that the vaccine was made available while I was in high school. It was newly made available to teenagers. I remember getting it, and it was not given to babies. This is in the late nineties. It was not given to babies, before the late nineties, it was only available to sex workers, nurses, doctors, and people who would be vulnerable or have exposure to hepatitis B because it spread through sex, sharing needles, and dirty blood transfusions. Which one of those three things is your newborn baby participating in? Is your newborn baby having unprotected sex? Is your newborn baby having dirty blood transfusions? Is your newborn baby sharing needles with someone down the street? No? Why is your newborn baby being given a vaccine for a disease they would have zero exposure to?

Sorry, I'm getting a little angry there. There's my soapbox—getting off of it. This is ridiculous. But here's the thing—we question it, but people who haven't been given that little set of information go, “Of course, I want to protect my child from hepatitis.” Of course, yes, but they have zero chance of exposure.

Why are we giving this one vaccine? They're not giving them the polio vaccine on the first day of birth. They're not giving them measles, mumps, or rubella on the first day of birth. Why is it so important that that baby not leave the hospital on the first day of birth without being given a vaccination for something that they have zero chance of exposure to?

Jodie Meschuk (0:24:26.932)

It's called standard of care, and a lot of money is the reason why. I mean, again, it's such a simple answer, but I think it's something that's very hard for the majority of the population to comprehend. I think we're getting there. Obviously, there's going to be, in my opinion, so much that's going to come to the surface in the next few years.

That's really exciting because, for me personally, I've been fighting for this ever since it happened to my child, ever since my child sustained a very severe vaccine injury. I'm sure we'll get into that. You just look at the hepatitis B vaccine, and again, it's standard of care. History-wise, instead of going and trying to identify the mothers who maybe are at risk, they have a drug history, or they were sexually active, a prostitute, whatever, they're in the high-risk category. Instead of taking the time to identify those, they decided, let's just give it to all babies. Think about how, on just a common-sense level, how ridiculous that is.

But what they realized was that it was also a lot of money and profit that they could make. One thing that I find to be so interesting is how people will blindly accept. Again, I was one of those. So you're right. We believed in vaccines at one point until our eyes were opened, and now we see the truth, and now we reject those vaccines. But I think if you think about the average person, it's very hard for them to comprehend that there would actually be an evil entity behind all this that actually really doesn't care about the health of your child. They only care about the bottom line, and they care about profit. That's really where we are today.

That's why the vaccine schedule has blown up the way that it has—solely because of profit and a lot of evil behind that industry. Parents just need to understand that these vaccines have other things in them. When you're looking at what's in them, especially hepatitis B, you have things like formaldehyde, you have sodium borate, you have sodium chloride, which, by the way, sodium chloride is not like taking Celtic sea salt. This immediately messes up the electrolyte balance in your baby and can cause jaundice because it's affecting the kidneys, it's affecting the liver. You have yeast proteins in it. We wonder why we have the amount of allergies that we have today in children when that never existed 20, 30 years ago.

They're getting injected with yeast proteins. They're getting injected with vaccines that have been grown in eggs. Why do we have such a huge egg allergy? All of these things are because of the assault that is happening every second of every day in this country on babies with needles. You have aluminum. I mean, not in hepatitis B, you don't have mercury—that's still present in flu vaccines, certain ones. So we have to understand what's actually in these.

If you think about your minutes-old baby, why are they so excited to inject them right away? To your point, why would a baby be sexually active? Why would a baby be exposed to a dirty needle, drug abuse? Instead, identify those people, and maybe they need something if there's a risk, but not 100% of the babies in this population.

Ashley James (0:28:17.355)

Well, let me ask you a question. Have you ever heard of a pandemic of babies having this illness? In the United States in your lifetime, anyone going, oh no, my baby has hepatitis B? Ever, ever, ever, ever before.

It shocks me. Then the amount of aluminum, because they say it's for the adjuvant, we have to aggravate the immune system so it takes it, so it takes hold or whatever. But the amount of aluminum is, it was something not even safe for a 200-pound man. It was crazy, it's really high. Then there's an eight, this is a little eight-pound baby.

You're immediately injecting them with a heavy metal that harms the brain and harms the kidneys, harms the nervous system. It's just, yes, it is, it's barbaric. Well, remember, standard of care a few hundred years ago was not washing your hands and bloodletting, losing leeches. 

You talked about your experience being in the hospital and that they have this standard of care, but what they're not practicing, which is, in my opinion, it's unethical. They're not practicing informed consent. True informed consent is explaining to you the benefits of that procedure, all the risks of that medication or procedure, and all the alternatives. When was the last time a doctor sat you down, especially while you were going through the birthing process, and said, okay, well, here's the benefits, here's the risks, here's all the alternatives. Never. They're just, no, you need this. Your baby needs this.

Jodie Meschuk (0:30:15.015)

Right, exactly. I do have hope that hopefully that will change soon. I think unfortunately the change is going to come because they're going to be forced to change. That's where you look at the medical system and you look at, obviously, I'm very passionate about babies and children and autism and these labels and this chronic disease epidemic and all of these things that can be prevented.

I want parents to remember that it can be prevented. Now, if somebody's in that position and they didn't know, trust me, I know exactly how you feel. You also can heal, your child can heal. But we have to also educate and continue to talk about this so that parents who are just starting this process know that they have a voice. They're the ones that hire and fire these doctors. They're the ones that make the choice of what route they want to go. They're the ones that, if let’s say your wife is on that table and they're giving birth and you have specifically said, do not cut that cord for 20 minutes, your husband is there to say, do not cut that cord for 20 minutes. We mean it. Being an advocate is incredibly important.

Unfortunately, we are in a day and age where you would think the advocate would be the medical system, but it's not. The advocate has to be you. So you have to know what your rights are. You have to know what other options there are. It is hard to find some of that information nowadays because of censorship, but that's why your platform and these podcasts are so important because you can't censor them. We have to be able to get that information out to people. 

Ashley James (0:32:10.351)

Well, YouTube still censors me. I put my podcast out everywhere, but YouTube will take down. I mean, I can't put any kind of vaccine episode, they will take down. So I'm looking forward to that no longer happening because they're being watched now. 

It's unfortunate. It's unfortunate. Yes, it's unfortunate how they've been. You've heard of last month, a five-year-old—he had never gotten any vaccines before. This is in Tennessee. I'll link it in the show notes of today's podcast at learntruehealth.com. I'll link this article. Five-year-old develops autism after being forced to get 18 vaccines in one day as part of a custody battle. A Tennessee judge ordered a family to vaccinate all three of their children, all whom had never been vaccinated. Five-year-old Isaac immediately became ill and was eventually diagnosed with severe regressive autism.

People say, well, there's been studies that prove that autism is not caused by vaccines. Yet we have this child who did not have autism until he was given 18 vaccines in one day, and now he has severe regressive autism.

There's the proof right there. This is standard of care—18 in one day—there are no safety studies on that.

Jodie Meschuk (0:33:41.711)

Correct. So there's a few lessons I think that this story brings up. There's quite a few actually. The first one is, I'll play devil's advocate here. I'll play the shoot. I'll pretend I'm a standard pediatrician. So let's say I'm a mom and I go into my well visit and I've got my little toddler with me, let's say, and it's ready for the next scheduled vaccines.

Number one, parents remember, your well visits line up with the vaccine schedule. So you need to think about that first. Why are the well visits spaced out the way that they are? Because it lines up with the vaccine schedule. It has nothing to do with keeping your child well. It has everything to do with getting them in and getting them a vaccine. So that's number one. But you look at this and let's say I were to go in and we're there for our scheduled appointment and I ask a question of the pediatrician and I go, hey, I heard this story.

I read this thing on the news where this child got vaccines, got 18, and they got autism. What’s that pediatrician going to say? First of all, that pediatrician's going to say, well, they could say, yes, that was a one-off thing. I mean, they got 18. I don't know if the story's true. I haven't read it. They're going to deflect. But it's very well possible that that pediatrician could say, well, I mean, if they got 18, that's kind of a lot or your pediatrician most likely is going to say, yes, I don't know about the validity of that story. I think it was probably made up. I mean, what did you find on social media? They're going to basically gaslight you. They're not going to say that that is valid. They're literally going to gaslight that mother.

The next thing that will happen too is, when you come into these studies that supposedly have proven that vaccines do not cause autism, if you look at those studies, they weren't even done properly. Look who funded the study. You have to always look at who funded the study and what was the outcome that they were trying to receive from that study. A lot of people don't realize that most of the studies done across the board are funded by Big Pharma, and who is the one making the profit from vaccines? Big Pharma.

But if you take a step back and you look at just as a common sense, hey, this family over here, they never vaccinate their children. Their kids are always healthy. This family over here, they follow the schedule. Their kids are always sick. You can literally do your own double-blind placebo just right there. You know what I mean? I look at my children and obviously we've learned so much since what we went through with a vaccine injury.

One of my children has never been vaccinated, never has received a round of antibiotics, never has been to a well visit. By all intents and purposes, the medical system would say my child should be dead. But my child who has never received any of that is the healthiest one of the entire family. So a lot of it is just common sense.

Now, the other lesson I think that we can learn from this story, and this is kind of a sad part of it, but I think it's where we are at as a culture is, there's a lesson here that we need to really be on the same page with our spouse when it comes to vaccines before we decide to have children.

What I have seen happen a lot in my own practice when I'm working with clients and I'm helping children heal from these labels and I'm walking hand in hand with these parents through the ups and downs is, the worst stories, meaning the hardest ones, are the ones where all of a sudden the mom decided to do her research and the husband refuses to believe it and wants the kids to get vaccinated. It creates such a wedge in that marriage and that relationship.

Before you got married, you just wanted to make sure that you had the same goals and dreams and maybe the same faith or whatever. But I'm going to tell you right now, you better have a conversation with that future spouse and make sure that you are both on the same page with vaccines because so many of these stories end up in the courts.

You know what the court's going to do? Side with Big Pharma. Period.

They're going to side with the standard of care because that's what a court does. So that's also just a really sad part of the story. Whatever happened in the court system, whatever happened with custody, all of that stuff, it's something that we need to be very aware of before we enter into having children.

Ashley James (0:38:43.788)

Yes, and hopefully be able to have those deep conversations with your family, with even your in-laws, because that's the thing where maybe the parents are 100 percent, but then the in-laws or the grandparents are freaking out and just be able to ask them to keep an open mind and not be so naive and so trusting of the mainstream medical system.

It's a for-profit industry. It's not this parental figure that loves you, that wants the best for you. This is what we do—we put it on a pedestal. When we start to go down this rabbit hole, the cognitive dissonance, some people just can't, it's so uncomfortable for them to accept because they were raised to believe that government agencies are their friend, are their loving, caring, almost their God, their loving, caring deity that wants the best for them.

My pediatrician's so nice. They want the best for me. They wouldn't hurt me or lie to me. The thing is, it's bigger. It's bigger than the nice man or the nice woman you've been seeing. It's bigger than the one doctor. It's a huge juggernaut. The industry is financially driven, and they suppress data, and we've seen it over and over again. You just have to be willing to go there. You have to be willing. You can't find this in the mainstream media because the legacy media is funded by the pharmaceutical industry.

If you don't believe me, go watch regular TV and count how many pharmaceutical commercials you see. It's pretty crazy. It's a pharmaceutical commercial because, at the end, they talk about anal leakage and death. It's always death. Okay. It's always death. There's your clue. So you can't trust your news source from any legacy, any company that gets money from Big Pharma isn't going to rat them out.

We've seen this. So you have to go deeper. You have to dig deep. I love the Children's Health Defense. I love the documentaries they put out.

But you have to be willing to kind of go to alternative media, this podcast, to be willing to go and seek out information. Yes.

Jodie Meschuk (0:41:18.264)

Well, I think we've definitely seen that shift. I mean, if you look at even the most recent election, it was only because of independent media that things had a chance, even had a chance versus without that independent media, there would be no chance. You look at COVID, look at how much was suppressed in COVID. I wrote about this the other day in one of my stories.

I don't know that the population, and we can relate this to parents. We can relate this to what that experience is like when you're in a pediatrician's office. When you're trying to navigate this medical system, which by the way, I would say don't even try to navigate it. Just exit it because you don't need it. If you're worried about a broken bone, you can go get urgent care and emergency care anytime you want, but you need to exit that system. That's a trap.

Basically, what's happening is that the entire population, it's almost as if they are married to a narcissistic, abusive spouse because that is exactly what the media has been doing to people for years. It's interesting because you saw this so clearly in 2020. I mean, I was the only one without a mask. I was the only one going opposite sides of the arrows on purpose. I was the only one.

My children never put a mask on. I'm not going to do it. You look at how many people fell in line, and it was as if they were in a relationship with an abuser and they didn't know how to get out of it. They didn't realize that they were actually being abused.

That's the thing. I don't think that parents as a whole realize, unless you're awake to it already. But if you're just the average person moving through life, you do not realize that the very system is just mentally abusing you every single day to keep you in line.

Until you realize that, you're not going to break free of that relationship.

Ashley James (0:43:24.751)

But what might make you break free is how much you love and care for your children and want them to be healthy. Unfortunately, sometimes it takes a vaccine injury. I've had so many friends where their first child was vaccine injured, and then that's what woke them up. But they had to see it with their own eyes. They had to see the gaslighting over and over again.

“Hey, my kid was walking, and now they can't walk anymore after their well visit.”

Or, “My child was making eye contact, and now they can't. Now they're just a floppy baby after their well visit.”

Really, really sad and scary.

I know this is a very complex answer, but give us a bit of the rundown. Why do vaccines cause neurological issues?

Jodie Meschuk (0:44:21.487)

So I'm glad you bring this up because I want, number one, we're gonna kind of take this back to autism for a second because it is an absolute exploding epidemic and it should not be.

You can look at autism, you can look at ADHD, you can look at sensory processing, you can look at eczema, you can look at asthma, you can look at insulin resistance that we are now seeing in six-year-olds, obesity, all of these things. Yes, they wanna put six-year-olds on Ozempic, just wait, it's coming.

It's already in the works. Big Pharma wants to make their money. So I want people to start looking at things for what they really are.

This took me time, by the way. Again, I had the blinders on, I blindly trusted the system. We paid the price for that. So I never trusted it again. Now, caveat, if I need emergency care, great. That is what they're good at. Save my life, then let me take care of it from there.

But this whole system of healthcare is corrupt at its core.

Going back to your question with the vaccine, if you look across the board at this epidemic of autism, for example, what really is it?

This is the question I want people to ask because if you go to the neurologist, what will happen is your child will be vaccine injured. Maybe you don't realize it's a vaccine injury at the time because there's sometimes a slow regression that happens. Sometimes there's a quick regression. It depends on how many the child receives. It depends on their body's ability to detox itself, their body's ability to have a strong defense system.

So every child's a little bit different in how this can show up.

But what we see most is that it shows up right around 20 to 24 months. A little bit right at that age two mark.

So what really is it?

It's brain inflammation. It's body inflammation.

Why are we calling it autism?

Because it's easy to call it that. Because it's easy for that neurologist to just look at that parent and say, “Your child has autism. I'm so sorry. Here's resources for you. All we can do is just hope that they get a little bit better and maybe talk one day.”

You're literally given no hope either, by the way, no hope whatsoever.

There's no talk about healing. There's no talk about what the root cause was and what the trigger was, which was the vaccine. Also could be environmental issues, damages. Look at our environment, look at our food supply, look at what's in it, look at the fluoride, look at all of the assaults that happen on the population.

Vaccines being one of the most and the biggest because if you look at the vaccine schedule, it's massive and it's massive what these babies and these children are receiving.

So what does a vaccine do?

Well, it's supposed to help, they say, to prevent disease. But what else is in there and how is that acting in the body?

Again, you go back to those ingredients. You go back to formaldehyde, aluminum—aluminum being the most common over mercury nowadays, but again, mercury is still present in some.

You have preservatives, polysorbate 80. You have formaldehyde like I mentioned. You have aborted fetal cells. Some people will go, “That was a long time ago.” No, no, no. They're still using aborted fetal cells. They still are. Do you know what gender that aborted fetal cell is that's being injected into your child? Is your child a boy and they're getting a girl? Is your child a girl and they're getting a boy?

I don't know. Think about that for a minute and how many they receive and how many assaults that are to their body with aborted fetal cells. But what happens? I want to take you guys through, okay? So I'll take you through a little piece of my story to kind of highlight this, which is here I am with my about 13-month-old child, and I'm pregnant with my second, very pregnant. We go in for the well visit.

Now, standard well visit, I was supposed to see our standard pediatrician, which we had an agreement at the time that I was going to be spacing out vaccines. So in the very beginning, when I first became a mom, I felt very uncomfortable about vaccines, but I just didn't know how to advocate for myself. Then over the course of the first year of my child's life, after repeated ear infections, repeated, 10 rounds of antibiotics, chronic illness,

chronic diarrhea, all of these problems, which absolutely pointed to vaccine injury. So I started to space them out because something inside me was screaming, but I just didn't know how to say it. I just didn't know how to stand in my power enough to walk away from it completely. So we were kind of half in the system, half out of the system. So we went in for a well visit, and the normal one, the normal pediatrician we had this agreement with wasn't there. I didn't know that. So the on-call pediatrician came in. Still to this day, I have such guilt and shame over not just getting up and walking out because something felt so wrong. But again, I just, I was paralyzed. I didn't have the confidence then that I have now. So the pediatrician comes in and looks at my child's chart.

He's like, “Boy, they're really behind, really behind on their vaccines.” I go, “Well, that's fine. We're spacing them out. I don't want to do too many.” He launched very quickly into this fear and gaslighting routine, which is what most parents will experience. Now again, I'm very pregnant with my second, did not have my husband with me. So maybe it would have been a different story if he was there, but I felt very backed into a corner. He proceeded to say things like, “Well, you wouldn't want your child to die of measles or polio or these things.” Imagine that question from a pediatrician. “You wouldn't want your child to die, would you?” How do you feel as a mom? So I go, “Well, no, but I just don't know that I trust all these. I don't know that they're safe.” Then it's, “Don't tell me you're one of those moms. Don't tell me you're one of those moms that goes to Google and listens to quack doctors, and all of a sudden you think vaccines are unsafe. I'll tell you right now, vaccines don't cause autism.” It's the line that they've been taught to say. They all say the same thing.

We kind of had this conversation back and forth, and I'm sweating, literally sweating in this freezing cold pediatrician's office, holding my child. He then says, “Well, it's really irresponsible of you not to do this, and you have to do this. We have to catch him up today.” I was like, “Well, I don't, I just, don't know.” “Would you give your child that many vaccines?” Because he was talking about giving my child nine vaccines, nine. Now, that's not 18, but I want parents to remember nine. Nine is not okay. Nine is not normal, but nine is very common today. It is not uncommon for a child to receive nine at a well visit because a three-in-one is three shots, you guys. It's not one shot, it's three. So if you have the MMR, that's three shots, but they make it sound like it's just one. So you could very well get a three-in-one, a three-in-one, and a couple other ones.

So he said, “Gosh, no, if I was you, I mean, I would give my child this in a heartbeat. They're totally safe. I would have no reservations whatsoever.”

I just kept hemming and hawing, and I'm sweating, and I'm like, I feel like I want to throw up, and my child's crying already. He says, “Well, if you're going to continue to give me a problem, then I'm going to have to call child services on you for being a negligent parent.”

Yes. People think that's crazy. The amount of mothers that I speak to and have spoken to in the last 14 years, it is very common for a pediatrician to threaten that. He threatened me. That is another reason why mothers cave, because they're threatened, and they don't know the truth, and they don't know what else to do, and you're backed into a corner.

That was me. That was me. I got backed into a corner. Everything in my body told me this is wrong. Just get out of the office. Just walk away.

But I was paralyzed. I felt like I was in an alternate universe and I couldn't move my body. Of course, then the nurse comes in, because the doctor doesn't inject your baby. No, no, no, no, no. The nurse does. The nurse gets to do it. She comes in with her tray of vaccines, and she proceeds to inject a three-in-one, a three-in-one, and then three separate ones. Nine vaccines. 

Meanwhile, my child is screaming bloody murder on the table. It's very common. Because what does a baby do when a needle comes at them and something hurts and it pokes? They scream. So this is what I want parents to understand, this visualization, which I had no idea was happening to my child on that table at that time, which was when that child is in fight and flight. I want you to think about when you're in fight and flight. When something happens, a car stops in front of you, and you slam on your brakes, and you get this flush of blood running through your body, and you get this tingly feeling. That's fight and flight. That's cortisol. That's protecting your body so it doesn't die in that moment, basically.

When that happens, the blood-brain barrier opens for a very specific purpose to flush. I want you to picture that little baby or that toddler on that table, and they are screaming, and that blood-brain barrier opens. Where do we think that aluminum is going to go? Where do we think that formaldehyde is going to go? It's going to go to the brain. And that blood-brain barrier that is supposed to stop that from happening, it can't, because that child is screaming, and they don't know what's happening, and they're scared. This is exactly what happens as a precursor to these neurological issues that we see in epidemic proportions today. This is autism. We need to stop calling it autism. I'll be honest with you. I'm very passionate. I'm very passionate about this topic, and in fact, the book I'm working on right now, because I'm redoing my original book Autism Reimagined, the book I'm working on right now, which is going to come out next spring, goes into this in great detail, which is the entire population is being lied to and manipulated right now as to what their children really have. They don't have autism. Your child does not have autism. Your child has brain inflammation. Your child has metals in their body. Your child is not proficiently detoxing this poison. So once you understand what it really is, all of a sudden, it makes sense. This bucket, this label, all of these labels, they come up with new labels every day, Ashley. Every day, there's a new label, because it takes the responsibility off of them. 

It puts the spotlight on this label of autism or whatever it is that you're going to call it so that it takes the guilt off of the mother, and it's just genetic. It's just the way it was. Then you're just told it's genetic. It's not genetic. How do genes change in epidemic proportions? They don't. It's impossible. Down syndrome never changes. Genetic malformations never change in their percentages.

How is it then that autism is genetic when it has exploded from one in 10,000 years ago to one in 22? How is that genetic? So we have to really start going back to the drawing board and looking at things for what they really are. That's how it begins. It begins with that child on that table getting injected when they're in fight and flight. Where do we think that poison's going to go?

Ashley James (0:57:30.305)

Well, I had Dr. Natasha Campbell-McBride on episode 385. I’ve had several other doctors on the show who talk about doing a very specific healthy diet and heavy metal detox for the children who are diagnosed with autism, and they get so healthy now they're not on the spectrum. Was that ever truly autism?

You can't—true, true, true autism, the one that was one in 10,000 kids, the one that was the savants you'd hear about, a Rain Man—though, you can't just heavy metal detox that person, and they're no longer autistic. But when we take dozens and just hundreds, hundreds and thousands of kids who've gone through the GAPS diet, who've gone through these heavy metal detoxes, then they're no longer on the spectrum. They're no longer in pain. They're starting to talk. They're starting to hug their parents. They're starting to look them in the eye. That's why they call it spectrum, not every child with autism has this level of brain inflammation that they're beating their head against a wall or punching their head or rocking, but their brain hurts so much. They're in so much pain. Their brain is on fire.

What was described to me, really interesting, the heavy metals that get in the brain, they vibrate with certain frequencies like WiFi. WiFi is at a frequency that vibrates the heavy metals, heating the brain up. It's like you're putting the brain in the microwave. So if you take a child with heavy metals in the brain and you put them in a no-WiFi environment, they're much more comfortable. It doesn't get rid of the problem. The heavy metals are still there, the inflammation is still there.

Immediately remove them from a WiFi environment, immediately get them on a healthier diet, for example, the GAPS, and start doing gentle heavy metal detox. I have so many episodes on that, where we talk about all the ways that you can support a child in detoxing. First of all, the human body was never designed to have that many chemicals be injected at any point in your life, no matter how big or small you are. But then some are more susceptible than others because MTHFR, just one example, the liver’s ability to detox or their detox pathways are compromised because foods are fortified with chemical artificial vitamins that are not great. They're the opposite. What is it? Folic acid actually blocks folate absorption. So if you're feeding your kid Cheerios, and there's folic acid in it, it blocks folate, which is the natural form. Then your liver has problems detoxing. Glyphosate is really high in these cereals. Glyphosate binds to heavy metals and then releases them in parts of the body where pH changes. So it actually helps deliver heavy metals. So if you got an injection of aluminum or if you get the mercury from a flu shot or whatever, it's going to grab onto these heavy metals and then release them in the kidneys and in the brain. It is a delivery system. So we have to clean up everything. Clean up the diet. Stop feeding processed food. Stop everything that feeds that inflammation. But as early as we can, start to question the standard practices because tell me, as a doctor, how many safety studies have you seen any pharmaceutical industry or the CDC produce or any company produce? Showing the safety of incorporating multiple vaccines, of taking one vaccine and putting three together? Any safety studies on taking three or more vaccines at the same time?

Jodie Meschuk (1:02:08.393)

That's just it, there aren't actual legitimate studies that show there's not a single study that follows the schedule the way that it is. That's a really big problem because they try to isolate things. So what they do is they isolate one vaccine, and they take a very small sample size, and they do it for a very short time. We watched them for a month, they were fine. What they're not studying and they refuse to study because they know what it will show is the bioaccumulation. It's the long-term ramification of the way that the childhood schedule is set up today. There's also some really good studies that show unvaccinated versus vaccinated populations and how much healthier the unvaccinated population of children are. But those aren't the ones funded by big pharma, of course. 

So they're hard to find, the really good ones, because they don't want you to find them. But then when you look at the studies that they try to shove down your throat all the time, or you go into that pediatrician's office as the typical mom and you just want the best for your kid, and you're asking some very normal questions that any mother would ask, which is, hey doc, are you sure these are safe? I heard these could cause autism, or I heard that my child could have a reaction. What they will say is, I've never seen a study that shows that because all they've read are faulty studies.

All they have been fed is this garbage that vaccines are safe. So they believe that. I really truly like to believe, though, that there are good pediatricians out there. I know that there are because obviously I know who some of them are. What you're gonna find, first of all, is that most of those pediatricians, if not all of them, don't operate within the insurance industry. They don't take insurance for a reason because the minute you start taking insurance, you're beholden to what they deem to be appropriate healthcare. 

So what you'll find is a lot of these good, well-meaning doctors, they actually are forced out of the system because if you speak up, you're fined. If you speak up, you get your license taken away. Look at California. You have doctors who are literally scared for their lives and their livelihoods because they can only write a handful of medical exemptions a year. If they go over that, they get their license taken away. They're under fire. So are these doctors, are these pediatricians actually operating from a place of truth? Are they operating from a place of fear? Unfortunately, a lot of them are operating from a place of fear. So they just toe the line and they just do what they're told. But again, you'll find the good ones.

It's just that most of them don't take insurance, and that's why they don't take insurance. But yes, I mean, across the board, you have to really understand at a very deep level what goes on behind the scenes. Even the fact that pediatricians get bonuses for vaccines. If you ask a pediatrician that is very deep into their love of vaccines, there's a couple that will come across my desk from time to time with things that they say, information that they're promoting out there. It's just so clear how brainwashed they are, that they literally are acting like the legacy media. You watch the news during the election cycle, I watch it, and I go, do they even realize the lies that are coming out of their mouth? The fact of the matter is, I think they do, but they do it anyway.

It's the same thing with pediatricians who are very deep into the system. You go and you observe, and you go, they just said that vaccines are safe and they don't cause autism. Do they even realize what they're saying? Do they even realize what a lie that is and how it's very clear because it's literally listed on the insert as a side effect? So why are they saying this? At the end of the day, we can never really truly get into the mind of someone other than the fact that I think a lot of them are in fear. Some of them actually really believe this stuff because they've been taught it in medical school. It's too hard to believe that they've been lied to. So they just continue to lie. Ask pediatricians, well, don't you get bonuses for having this fully vaccinated childhood population in your practice? No, no, no, I don't get bonuses. Really? Because I'm kind of looking at Blue Cross Insurance right now.

You actually do get a bonus if you have a certain percentage of children who get vaccines in your office. So why are you lying? But it's just an interesting landscape out there. We just go back to, it's up to the parents. It's up to us to really see the truth. It's up to us to do the digging. It's up to us to stand up and advocate for our children, because at the end of the day, the system will not. You might come across a diamond in the rough, needle in a haystack, maybe.

I mean, we did. We eventually came across a pediatrician who actually believed me and who helped me in my early years of healing my child and doing some things that were well outside his experience, but he was willing to do it because he believed me and he understood the heart of a mother. He was willing to put his practice on the line to help me heal my child. They're far and few between. So at the end of the day, we just have to know this information and know how to stand up for our kids. Sorry, I got off track there a little bit.

Ashley James (1:07:59.399)

No, no, not at all. You're absolutely right. Okay. We went down a nice side conversation because we had to unpack this whole, you were there in the hospital feeling uncomfortable. They were doing all these things, and we talked about that vaccine. We just had to unpack that vaccine. It's kind of the most ridiculous, of all the vaccines they give your child, they give it at the most ridiculous time. This has to wake you up. This has to wake people up. It's a vaccine, it was only given to prostitutes and people at high risk. Was it even available to the public? They're giving it to a newborn seven-pound baby. That doesn't make sense, and it's standard of care. We have to start questioning the standard of care. 

Jodie Meschuk (1:08:57.405)

Not only that, but a week later, what do you get? The DTaP, the Hib, you get more. Literally a week later, then a few weeks later after that, then a month later after that. You guys just take a step back and see. You have a vaccine schedule that is upwards of 90 vaccines at this point, almost from birth to age five. They just quietly added the COVID vaccine without telling anyone, without telling anyone. So if somebody were to do all the optional ones, flu vaccine, which again, depending on who you go to and what climate you live in, meaning what kind of area type of thing, flu should be optional, but it's not really told to you that it's optional. But if you look at the entire schedule, plus COVID now, you're looking at upwards of 90.

That's a hell of a lot of injections into a child. How is their body supposed to process that? This is interesting because we'll always have the people that say, well, I was fine. You mentioned food quality, all of the garbage that's in food, the glyphosate, the hybrid wheat, the atrazine, the food coloring, all of the preservatives, all of this stuff. Now granted, I grew up on some of that stuff. But I also only received about four vaccines in my life. I mean, my mom probably could have done more, but I think my parents were probably just kind of, yes, we'll do a few. They weren't overly medical, meaning they didn't fear things. I didn't go to the doctor for every cold. We see what is happening today in kids. A lot of stuff was just, drink some chicken soup and watch The Price Is Right and lay on the couch.

Even if you grew up eating garbage food, we're trying to basically make a straw man argument here, which is number one, the vaccine schedule wasn't the same as it is now. Even in the 90s, it wasn't the same as it is now. Even it was ballooning in the 90s, but it's still not the same. The amount of chemicals in food were not the same as today. So any person saying, well, I'm fine,

I had vaccines, I ate garbage food. It's not the same. That's the problem, it's not the same. You can't compare an orange to an apple.

Ashley James (1:11:25.980)

If the grandparents of your kid are going, well, I'm fine. I got vaccines. They got three. Polio, smallpox, and DTP. That's it.

In 1962, they got five doses in total. They had five doses. Now it's, you said, it's over 70 doses. Back in 1983, it was 24 doses over the period of 15 years.

Jodie Meschuk (1:11:53.297)

They also didn't have chemtrails. They also didn't have fluoride in their water. They also didn't have glyphosate, and they didn't have food dyes.

Ashley James (1:12:00.773)

Yes, 80,000 man-made chemicals created in the last 40 years that are in our air, food, water, soil.

Jodie Meschuk (1:12:08.249)

We wonder why we have an epidemic today. I'll also get parents that will say, well, my child didn't receive any vaccines and they have autism. I go, okay, tell me about all the other stuff.

Because although vaccines are a very big root cause for a lot of the things that we see today, there's also, what was the mother's state of health? Did they get a flu shot? Did they get a Tdap? They pushed that Tdap like crazy on mothers. Now COVID and flu shots together.

What was the state of their oral health? Did they have metal fillings in their mouth? Did you know that it leach into their bloodstream and cause a problem with their baby? We live in a world where they want so desperately for you to just look at one thing and that's it.

Autism isn't genetic at all. Vaccines don't cause autism, but what about all the other things?

So there's just so many factors at play that although I will say it's a lot rarer for a child to have autism when they have not received any vaccines, meaning a child who is on the typical schedule, they're just waiting for something to happen to their body.

It can be a wide range of things. It can be chronic eczema. It could be ADHD, could be sensory processing, could be gut dysfunction, or just gut dysbiosis. It could then go into autism.

There are so many things, but all they care about is that the entire world thinks autism is genetic. That's literally all they care about, but they can't prove it.

Ashley James (1:13:53.855)

My gosh, if it's genetic, then how common like three generations who went from one in 10,000 to one in every single classroom.

Jodie Meschuk (1:14:04.061)

Right. The data doesn't lie, but they want you to look at skewed data. 

Ashley James (1:14:10.549)

Okay, so there you were. Your child received nine shots. Then what happened? Your child was crying. Then what happened? What did you first notice that made you think there was something wrong?

Jodie Meschuk (1:14:32.485)

The first thing was honestly, it's one of those traumatic memories that never goes away. I've done a lot of work, emotional healing, obviously. I have been willing to look at the truth and all the anger that I had back then about what happened. The most important thing that I look back on that I did was instead of sitting in that anger and not doing anything, I used that anger to heal my child. I used that anger to prove the system wrong.

I put myself back in that place, and I can still see it very clearly today. That trauma will never go away. Meaning that guilt I feel as a mother will never go away, that I allowed that to happen to my child. Which is why I wake up today, every morning I wake up and I go, I've got to save all the babies. That's literally my mission in life. I want to save all the babies. One day, when I die, I want my legacy to be that I played a hand in stopping this autism epidemic because it's so brutal. It's so brutal to watch children go through this.

So there were nine vaccines and crying, which is obviously any child is going to cry when they get poked, but I just remember feeling paralyzed, crying. I was literally crying as the nurse was doing it. How sad that that nurse just kept doing it and didn't stop and go, honey, what's wrong? How sad. What a terrible bedside manner. But there I am crying, quickly picking up my child, and I run out of that office because I knew—I just knew that what I did was wrong, and I couldn't take it back.

I think that's another thing that if parents can just remember that once you do it, you can't take it back. It's not like trying to flush an antibiotic out of the system, which is obviously a lot easier than a vaccine. You literally can't take it back. There's no “oops, now get it out of the system.” No, that's not how it works with a vaccine.

So I got in my car, and we were supposed to go to a playdate, a park playdate. There I am just driving, crying in the car. I think I called my mom and just felt horrible. What's my mom going to say? She's the best mom in the world, but she's just like, “It'll be okay, honey. They'll be fine. Everything's okay.” She's just reassuring me. But I just knew in my heart of hearts that what I did was going to have consequences.

He just never stopped crying. I know for a fact that brain inflammation started pretty quickly. I went to the park. My friends also tried to console me, like good friends do. It was interesting because I would say at the time half of my friends—we were all in the same stage of life, having our first babies and starting families. We were in MOPS together and Bible study. We went to the park all the time.

Half of them were not vaccinating because they were already awake to it. Half of them were. I do remember distinctly having some of these conversations with my friends, and I know that they were trying gently to kind of open my eyes, but I just wasn't there yet. So we got to the park, and my child just never stopped crying.

That night, there was this shrieking cry. So it turned into—you think about your child crying, and there's the normal fussy cry, there's the “I'm hungry” cry, there's the “I'm overly tired” cry. This was a shrieking cry that I had never heard come out of my child before. It got so bad that night. I called the urgent line for the pediatrician, and I said, “I think my child's having a reaction. I don't know what to do. They have a fever. They're having the shrieking cry.” They just said, “Give him Tylenol and Motrin. Just rotate Tylenol and Motrin.” So that's what I did. Yes.

Ashley James (1:18:55.970)

Okay. Let's pause. Let's pause. You're a naturopath. Now, is there a class action lawsuit against Tylenol? So, OK, why is it the worst thing to give a child after a vaccine? Why is Tylenol the worst thing?

Jodie Meschuk (1:19:18.828)

Well, the most simple explanation, I always like to keep things very simple for people because I don't think that the average mother needs to go into the weeds. You just need to understand why something is bad. So I know, I know, simple, yes.

Ashley James (1:19:35.696)

I want to go into the weeds. Okay, so keep it simple. if you could  go, go, go deep, feel free to go deep. We have a lot of very, very intelligent listeners here. All the intelligent listeners come to this podcast. 

Jodie Meschuk (1:19:43.302)

That's awesome. Well, I think really one of the simplest explanations and what is most important to remember is that when you dose Tylenol and even when you dose it for a fever, it's doing a kind of fake effect in the body. So it's fake bringing that fever down or making that child feel more comfortable, but it's not actually doing anything to heal the root cause.

So if you look at brain inflammation and if my child was, their body is going to go into a natural fight mode because that's truly how God has designed our bodies. Our bodies are designed beautifully and intelligently with no mistake to fight a fever, to fight pollutants that come into our body. Now, yes, we're going to have those very small percentage of times where we may need some emergency care, but you guys, you have to remember, that percentage is so tiny. They just want you to believe that it's everything. Go to the ER when your child has coughing, go to the ER when your child has 104. We don't have to do that. But anyways, I digress. 

So when the body is trying to naturally fight something, which is the case of my child, probably going into, how do I mitigate this? How do I get rid of this metal? So we go into the brain inflammation, the encephalitis basically, and you dose Tylenol.

What Tylenol does is it depletes the body's glutathione levels. Okay, so glutathione is just really important when it comes to this natural response that the body has with its immune system to help clear infection, to help clear toxicity. So if that is diminished from Tylenol, now the body doesn't have that natural ability to be able to do what it needs to do. It's hampered.

Without the proper amount of glutathione to be able to clear what was going on or at least help it in some way. Now again, I can't go back to my story and go, well, if I didn't do Tylenol, everything would have been fine. I think the damage was done, honestly. I think dosing the Tylenol made it worse. So anytime that Tylenol is used, we just have to remember that your body's glutathione is its natural ability to fight infection. If that is depleted from Tylenol, then the body can't naturally fight what it wants to fight. 

Glutathione is important. It's an antioxidant. It's important for cellular repair, disease prevention. It's your basic immune support antioxidant, but it's also for brain health. Glutathione protects the cells of the hippocampus. It's responsible for memory and learning, but it's also responsible for your brain cells in general and keeping them healthy.

So that was a very, very detrimental thing that I think. Again, I can't go back to my story and go, well, they would have been fine, but it certainly didn't help. It made it worse in terms of how my child's body was unable to try at any measure to try to repair itself and to try to repair the brain.

Ashley James (1:23:08.920)

So they said give it Tylenol, which then suppresses the ability to detox further. Did your baby stop crying?

Jodie Meschuk (1:23:28.796)

No, it was days and days of this kind of shrieking cry. Now the fever, again, here's what a parent's gonna be told. It's totally normal after a vaccine for your baby to get a fever. It's just the body building immunity to the infection that it was injected with. No, my friends, the fever is because there's poison in the body.

The fever is because the body does not know what to do with this foreign stuff that has come in. Now, it'd be great. You wanna try to make a vaccine that supposedly spurs an immune response in the body, try to make it without those poisons. I think more people would probably be open to, like okay but what that is? That's homeopathy, basically. That's homeoprophylaxis. So that's kind of your way that you gently introduce these diseases to the body to help build immunity because we're also in a state as well today where children are not getting natural infections. They're not getting chickenpox like they're supposed to. They're not getting measles like they're supposed to. They're getting these fake infections. So that response that happens in the body is not because the body's just trying to make some antibodies. It's like, what the hell is this aluminum? What the hell is this formaldehyde? What do you want me to do with this?

We need to understand that too, because you're going to be gaslighted at every angle when you take your baby in or you call. I called. I was not told that that was a vaccine reaction. I said on the phone, I think my child's having a reaction. No, it's normal. Your child's not having a reaction. It's very normal to get a fever. It's very normal for them to be fussy. Just give them Tylenol and rotate Motrin with it. You're not even told the truth that it is a reaction.

All of this eczema that we see pop up in babies, that's actually a vaccine reaction. But you're gaslighted into, no, it's normal, babies get eczema, here, slap this steroid cream on it. It just happens all the time. So that was us, which dosed the Tylenol and the Motrin. Over time, obviously, the fever started to get better, the screaming started to get better, but it turned into a brain injury, basically. It turned into my child was never the same until we got my child back and we healed them. Loss of words, unable to have eye contact, just all of those classic symptoms that again, what are they gonna do? They're gonna go, it's autism. We've made this list of symptoms. So if they fall into that, it's autism. No, it's brain inflammation. It's poison in the body. It's heavy metals. It's the body cannot detox very well. Now, oops, you have gut dysfunction. It's all of that, but let's just call it autism. It's crazy.

Ashley James (1:26:34.985)

So. How did you find the answers? To helping your child heal from this and now no longer be on a spectrum.

Jodie Meschuk (1:26:51.661)

Yes, so it took a while, but I will say my turning point. So my first turning point where I opened my eyes was when I was in that pediatrician's office. I vowed at that point, I will never be in this position again. It took time to gain my confidence with that, but I never went back. Okay, that's very important. It's when you are in those moments, that's a teachable moment. We need to listen to that voice inside of us.

We need to heed that warning and we need to stand in our power. So it was when I took my child to see the neurologist, because at that time where I was at in California, it felt very apparent that you needed to have something on paper in order to get help. Now, I didn't know what help that I was looking for at the time because it was all new to me. So it was kind of like, okay, let's take one step at a time here and see where the road takes us in the system. All in the system, because I wasn't yet very awake to, I could actually reverse this damage in my child. That was kind of in the back of my mind, but I didn't really believe that that was possible at that moment. So I went to the neurologist and this was the turning point. So I'm there with my child and my newborn that I had recently, because remember I was pregnant when all this happened. 

So I have my newborn baby and I have my other child. She goes in and does all the testing on him and all the standard things. I'm sitting there waiting and I'm kind of looking through the mirror, because it was one of those two-sided mirrors where you can look into the evaluation room. I kind of chuckled a little bit because my child wanted nothing to do with this neurologist. They knew that this person was bad news. So they just wanted nothing to do with them. 

Anyways, did the testing, comes out, we sit down, and she looks at me very matter of factly. She goes, well, looks like, everything on the checklist, everything that I went through, I think it's safe to say we can just give your child this diagnosis of autism. Very matter of fact, no emotion, no feeling, no empathy, nothing. So I go, okay. I mean, it really wasn't a surprise to me because obviously I saw what happened to my child. I saw what happened from the point that they received those nine vaccines to where we were at that point. At that point, he was almost two.

So I said, okay, I just have a question though, because I've been doing a little bit of research. She rolled her eyes at me, research, here it comes. I said, I've kind of been looking at changing the diet. Do you think it would be valuable to remove gluten, maybe do some probiotics? Just very basic stuff that I was researching. Very basic things, by the way, that would help any child be healthy.

They're not like controversial things. Don't eat hybrid wheat, take some probiotics. This should not be controversial. She looks at me and she says, well, you're one of those, huh? First of all, all that stuff you're reading is garbage. I'm kind of summarizing here, but basically she told me what I was reading was garbage, that I can't go to Google to find information.

That changing the diet will do nothing, that this is genetic. There's just nothing I can do. I go, okay, well, I mean, it might be worth a try at least. She's, well, yes, I mean, I guess if you want to, but honestly, don't waste your time. I mean, she was just so rude, the worst bedside manner. She then went to say, well, I have two sons. I have two boys, they have autism. Let me tell you, it's genetic, there's nothing you can do.

Then she points at my newborn and says, you really should be prepared that your other child will probably have autism too, because it's genetic. My baby was four months old, maybe I'm, what? What do you mean? Then she pointed at my belly and said, you really should consider not having any more children.

So that's when I really woke up. That's when the anger came over me that I wanted to punch her. I'll be honest. I wanted to do bodily harm, but I would never do that. But I was so angry that I left that office and I drove home white knuckling my steering wheel, crying like I've never cried before.

I got home and that is when I vowed to prove her wrong. So really I can thank her because she was the reason we are where we are today. If she did not tell me that, if she would have said, yes, I mean, you can maybe try a few things. I'm so sorry you're going through this. Here's some options for therapy. It maybe would have been a different story. I don't know.

But she crossed the line and it was exactly what I needed to have happened in that moment for me to turn that anger that had been festering inside of me for months, because I was angry. I was angry at what happened in that office when he got nine vaccines. I was mad at myself for allowing it to happen. I think this is a part of the story that so many mothers are in if they have a child right now that has a child with any type of label, but in particular autism, because it's just so, it's just so detrimental walking through it. It's so hard. It's so difficult and emotional. I felt shame. I felt literal shame for months that I could never really point the finger that it was shame.

Shame is very interesting because it's not guilt. Guilt is, oops, I did something wrong. So I think I felt guilt first, but then the shame consumed me that I was a bad mother for what I did. That's not talked about enough. You have so many mothers who are in this position and they're paralyzed because they feel shame.

They feel they are the worst mother in the world because they allowed this to happen to their child. Then at every turn in the medical system, they're just gaslighted, which only makes the shame worse and paralyzes them more. So for me, there was something inside of me that was, screw you, lady, I'm proving you wrong. That's what I did.

Then I vowed at that moment, I will uncover everything I can. I will turn over every rock. I don't know how many sleepless nights I had researching stuff, trying different things, changing our lifestyle, just completely becoming an entirely different human being and family and never looking back. But the good news is, it took about five years, but my child is back.

They are amazing. They don't have that damage anymore. We reversed it. We healed them. You would never know the history of what we went through. So it can be done. But I think the problem is, I always ask myself this question too, why are more parents not doing this? Why are more parents not believing that they can heal their child?

Why do I have parents, mothers come onto my social media, let's say, and say nasty things? You're crazy, it's genetic, there's nothing you can do, my child was born this way, I celebrate this diagnosis, I celebrate my child. Why do they do that?

Because they're in shame. They literally don't feel there's any path forward and it's too hard to look in the mirror and say, okay, I didn't know, but now I know and I'm gonna do something about it. Then every turn that they go, the school district, the neurologist, the pediatrician, big pharma, every article they read that is carefully crafted on Google, says it's genetic and you should celebrate the diagnosis. So what do we expect? It's just such an evil system.

Ashley James (1:36:22.343)

Once you become awake to this, then you start to see it everywhere. Then you start to see, there's no corporation that's out for my health. I have to start to really question everything. Every food product, you have to take responsibility and start to question everything and start to learn how you can protect your family. This is a very toxic world, and you have to learn how to navigate it in a way that protects your family.

Jodie Meschuk (1:37:03.250)

I think that can be very overwhelming to people, honestly. I think that's actually another reason why I observe that there's parents who don't do anything when they could be doing something is that it just feels too hard, which I understand that. It's easier to understand the, don't do anything because it feels overwhelming versus the, I don't do anything because I refuse to, and I just want to sit here and believe that this is genetic and celebrate this diagnosis, wear the blue puzzle piece, and put the sign in the front lawn and all of that stuff. We're in this culture that literally celebrates disease. 

Literally, you go onto these social media sites and it's gross what you see out there. The adults that are, my gosh, I have ADHD, ha ha ha, no. Why are we celebrating this? Why are we wearing these diseases like a badge of honor? It's gross. But I think you have two different camps. You have the ones that just don't know what to do, and they're overwhelmed. So we need to just make it easier for them to understand that and say, okay, start here like literally start here. Let's start with changing the diet. Let's start with making sure that you get the right therapy because if you're doing ABA, you're in the system, honey, and your child's not going to improve. ABA is training a puppy, and your child is not a puppy.

So let's get you the right therapy. Let's make sure you have an advocate for the right IEP so that you can fight the school district. They're giving you one hour of speech a week. No, honey, you deserve five. We're going to fight for you to get that. Start somewhere. Start with simple things. Then you have your other camp, which just wants to celebrate because they get attention.

Ashley James (1:38:52.056)

Yes. How about getting attention from a different community that wants to celebrate you winning your child's health back? Because I will be right there to celebrate with you.

Jodie Meschuk (1:39:07.132)

Exactly. I will celebrate that too. I get to do that. Mean, that's the cool, for years, I mean, again, I'm in a different place today because it's been years down the road, but there were many, many years that I kind of just sat in like, why did this happen to me? Why did this happen to us? Why did we have to go through this?

I finally realized it's because God, first of all, doesn't give us more than we can handle. Second of all, God does give us hardships in life so that we can use that for His good. So for me, my passion is now helping other kids heal, walking with parents. I get to see these kids heal firsthand. I get to get the texts and the phone calls and get on a Zoom session with these parents who are, Jodi, I never thought my child was going to talk again. I get to hear the tears from mothers who are like, my gosh, my child just said mama. Do you know what that feels like to a mother to have your child say mama? You've never heard that before? That will break you. I get to see these kids thrive and heal and change. Instead of just staying where they were. But it's the fact though that these parents were willing to do it. These parents were willing to do the hard. They were willing to buck the system. They were willing to just say, you know what? I've got nothing to lose. That was me. I told myself in a very dark moment, I think my child was probably about three at the time and we were maybe a year into doing some healing stuff. I told myself, I will not look back 20 years from now and say, I could have, I should have, but I didn't. I won't do it. That's when I really got serious about healing.

Ashley James (1:41:17.280)

Yes. So obviously you can't give us all the answers in just sitting down in a podcast, but guide us in the right direction. Of course, we want to make sure we read your books and follow you on your great social media, great Instagram account. You've got this wonderful website.

Where's a good place to start? What are some key things that parents can do right now, starting today, to help their child detox, to help bring down the inflammation, and help their brain heal?

Jodie Meschuk (1:41:55.886)

Yes, so here's what I would say. Keeping it very simple, because I think it is important to keep things simple initially, because small things actually make really big impacts. So the first step is we have to turn the tap off, which means no more vaccines. It's really hard when I'm working with parents and they're still one foot in the system and one foot out. It's, well, I'm spacing them out now, or I just did one. It's, nope, they're literally all poison.

Nope, turn the tap off. If you're really worried about disease, let's have that conversation and talk about terrain and talk about what disease really means and talk about, hey, if your child were to happen to get something random and maybe their body had a difficult time with it, okay, great, let's talk about emergency care and what can happen there. But we gotta turn the tap off. So that means, doing an overhaul of the home. What toxins are in the home? Let's get those out of the home. No more well visits, just turn the tap off of the poison coming in. Then, let's take some steps now to see where we can make the biggest movements based off of the child. So with the autism spectrum, and I know we're using this one as an example a lot today only because really my passion is very much into autism healing and telling the truth about it. But you can apply this across the board to any chronic disease or illness. 

So there's a wide range of what some children experience. Some children are very, very picky with what they eat. So we have to start there. Some children are not as picky, but they're struggling with more verbal language or they're struggling with eye contact. You have to start with, what's the thing and the door that is a little bit open right now that we can work with? 

So I will say when it comes to food, this can be one of the most challenging pieces of a healing program. Here's why, if you think about it, you have a child that is very self-limiting with their diet. Now you have Dr. Natasha on, I love her. We did the GAPS diet. I will tell you right now, the GAPS diet is the gold standard, literally the gold standard. If any child with any chronic illness did the GAPS diet, they would heal. Hands down, no question about it. The problem is, you have a mother, and I know how this feels, because my own child was eating yogurt and McDonald's chicken nuggets, and that's it. That's it. So put yourself in the position of a mother that is, they already feel guilt and shame, regret. They're emotional, they're in fight and flight. They're just trying to survive. Their child won't eat anything but McDonald's chicken nuggets and yogurt. 

This is the first barrier, is it's this emotional barrier we have to break through with the mother, because if I'm in fight and flight and I have all these emotions, and I try to give my child a cup of bone broth, and they throw it across the room, because of course they are, and why are they gonna do that? They have brain inflammation, they have gut dysbiosis. They're like a cocaine addict. They literally want their next hit of gluten and dairy and MSG.

Ashley James (1:45:30.202)

MSG, we have to remember it's a high glutamate. A lot of times it's a high glutamate diet that exacerbates it as well. Any fast food you're going to get, there's MSG in it. That includes Chick-fil-A. There's actually three different kinds of MSG in Chick-fil-A. It was crazy. Read the ingredients. The biggest thing that helped me go eat super clean and feed clean food to my child is, if you can't read small print, bring your readers, bring your little reader glasses or whatever you got from the dollar store, from the pharmacy or whatever. 

It's worth it to sit and read the ingredients. If you're going to eat out at a fast food restaurant, all the ingredients are online. If you read the ingredients, you are more likely to say, no thanks. I actually don't want that. There's multiple kinds of sugar. There's multiple kinds of oil that are incredibly unhealthy oils. The MSG that is crack cocaine to the brain. It's an excitotoxin, it is not healthy, especially for children on the spectrum. You're right. They have a food addiction. But very quickly, you will be able to detox, and you can detox a child very quickly. Take screens away from a kid. The first three days, they're so pissed off at you because they're detoxing. The fourth day, you have a little angel on your hands. It really is just hunker down for the first few days if you're going to help your child detox from food or from screens, and in seven days off of those processed foods or seven days off the screens, you're going to see such a shift in their mental well-being and in their emotional well-being. It's really worth that detox. So it's kind of like in Trainspotting, I think it was, where they have to lock themselves in a room. That heroin addict locks themselves in a room with two buckets basically. They have to ride it out. That's you. You have to ride it out, but it's short. It doesn't take that long to detox from the food you're addicted to. So, okay, it does take sitting down going, I'm just going to just try it, just try it. It's not going to be as bad as it is on the first day. I promise you it won't be that bad on the seventh day. You know what I mean? 

Jodie Meschuk (1:47:49.026)

That's just it, it's willpower. I think again, you take a mom who's already in such disarray, their child maybe just got a diagnosis. They've just gone through all this trauma. This is why it's so difficult for parents and mothers especially to break through that diet wall or that food wall is because the first few days are going to be horrendous as your child is basically having a withdrawal of gluten. But that needs to happen.

So, I mean, I remember our story, it was the first three days I was, my gosh, this is torture. I don't know if I can do this. Then all of a sudden, magically put that bone broth down, they start to drink it because the brain is letting go of those addictions. It's again, think about a drug addict coming off of a withdrawal. 

The first, however long, is horrendous, but then it's like, the veil lifts. So that piece is very important. I cannot stress enough the GAPS diet, the healing piece of food, but again, we have to help. This is what I especially love is helping walk parents and mothers through, you can do this, I promise, stay strong. Here's what you can give your child in the meantime. Here's how we're gonna get them through this. You're going to see the light at the end of the tunnel, but

so many people that I've had conversations with, the very first thing they say to me is, well, I've tried that diet, it didn't work. Okay, explain to me what you mean by you tried. Well, my child threw a fit on the first day, they didn't want to do this, and I felt they were gonna starve, so I quit. That's not trying, that's not trying. But I get it because it's very emotional. So I understand and I empathize with that. I've walked through it but this is why we have so many people out there also, well, there's no healing. I've tried it. It's genetic. Now I'm just gonna believe what the system says. It's genetic. It's because this wall is so hard to break through, but it is possible.

So food is very important. Again, I can't recommend the GAPS diet enough. Just get the book and read her book. It's incredible. It opens your eyes so much to stuff. Then the next piece is therapy.

So the very first thing a child is gonna be ushered into is ABA, Applied Behavioral Analysis. This is the most wretched form of therapy in my opinion. It's basically abuse in my opinion. You're training a child like they're a puppy. They're sitting down and you're saying, do this, knock, knock, here's your treat. Do this, knock, knock, here's your treat. This is not how we help a child heal. 

So when it comes to therapy, a couple of things that parents need to understand, which is you're going to get what the system determines that you deserve, which is going to be the bare minimum. It's going to be ABA because it's cheap and it has become the standard of care. So what you need to do is you need to fight back. Oftentimes you have to have an advocate to do this that really knows the legal language, knows the system. It'll probably cost you a few hundred bucks, but it is well worth it to have that advocate type up a letter for you in legal language.

That person on the other end of, let's say it's the regional center. So most states have something called a regional center, which is where the child will be put first before they turn three. That regional center will often test them and then they will determine what they qualify for. Again, you're gonna get the bare minimum and you're gonna get ABA. So what you need to do is you need to fight back and say, nope, I actually want five hours of speech therapy and I actually want floortime therapy.

Ashley James (1:51:31.883)

What kind of therapy?

Jodie Meschuk (1:51:32.449)

Floor time. Stanley Greenspan is the father of floor time therapy, and it's phenomenal. It literally helps bring the child's personality back out. It gets on their level of play. It's play therapy. So it brings skills out, and it develops their brain versus ABA, which is rote. Total difference in therapy in terms of the approach for a child. So I always tell parents, no, you need to get floor time therapy. 

So that's going to be, again, it's going to take a little while because what you're going to have to do is you're going to have to keep fighting with the system. You're going to have to keep looking for therapists. You're going to fire some therapists along the way, but you're going to find that really good one that understands floor time therapy. That's where your child needs to be. So therapy is kind of a beast in a bucket in itself, but what I would recommend right off the bat, is to know that you are the one as the parent that drives the conversation, not the other way around. You as the parent are telling them what your child needs and what your child deserves. You do not stop until you get that. So when you're looking at healing across the board, you're doing some of these other building blocks like changing diet, healing the gut, probably doing a little bit of a detox. The detox is totally different depending on what the triggers were, what the poison is basically in the body. But when you're doing those things and therapy that actually matters, all of those things kind of come together, and they support each other. There's a happy domino effect that happens. I've seen children who have been in ABA for years, years they've been in ABA, no other healing that they're doing, meaning no detox, no diet changes, they're still eating garbage, they're still getting vaccines, they're still getting antibiotics for every ear infection. They get worse. They get worse. 

I've also seen kids who are doing some healing stuff, but they're still doing ABA, and they're not making any improvements. So that therapy piece is still very, very important. I'm a huge fan of it, but it just has to be the right kind. You gotta hit it really hard in the beginning. So those first years, up until a child is about five and a half or six, matter a lot when that brain is open to receiving information, and the brain is still developing and doing a lot of leveling up in that timeframe of the child. That is one of the most important periods to hit it really hard with good therapy. But those are kind of the buckets I look at. So there's the first bucket of turn the tap off, stop with the toxicities coming in. Then there's the detox. Again, that's going to depend upon the child. I do different detoxes depending on health history, all that stuff. There's no single one detox that every child is going to heal on. There are some pieces that are the same, but you just kind of adjust it slightly for the child. Then there's the food piece, which to me, the food piece is incorporating the gut healing part of it because food and all of that stuff really do make a difference in terms of sealing the lining of the gut. So that leaky gut or that gut dysbiosis, that's where the GAPS diet is really crucial for that. Then outlier things.

Most of these children are very deficient. They're deficient in minerals. They're deficient in crucial vitamins, antioxidants because of gut dysbiosis. Their body is not processing anything. So there is a supplement-type regimen. There are important pieces there. But I'm also really a big fan of not overwhelming parents. I don't think that a child needs to be on 50 different supplements. I think that it needs to be a very intentional program where you're gonna get the most bang for your buck, so to speak. So that's really where you're looking at those core pieces, most important for the brain. What does the brain need? The brain needs fats and minerals. Again, that's where the GAPS diet comes in, but then that's also where minerals come in. So they're very deficient in minerals, which means their brain's not really going to respond as well to things if they don't have enough minerals in them. So just, yes, things like that.

Ashley James (1:56:07.281)

Yes, absolutely. We are all minerally deficient because of the farming practices of the last hundred years. Now, even if you did eat a vegetable, there's so many, I get iron from spinach. I could bet you money there's no iron in, excuse me, there's no iron in your spinach because it's grown hydroponically. Plants can grow in water, hydroponically with unnatural sunlight, with artificial sunlight, with NPK and that's it. They can be absolutely void of the 60 essential minerals. 

It's really sad. A lot of the farmlands have been over-farmed, and the farming practices, the chemicals they use, and the way they till have leached all the minerals out of the soil. So we are, as a nation, minerally deficient.

Then you take a child who has been stressed. The body, when you put a stressor on it, has to use up its resources, use up its nutrients in order to combat that. So you're a child who has gone through that, who's gone through vaccine injury, is nutrient deficient because their body has had to use up whatever it has. Then you're feeding them chicken nuggets and yogurt, not just you, but it's common.

They're very particular about what they eat. So then they're just being given a mono diet that is really void of the 90 essential nutrients. But we don't want to overwhelm them by giving them a bunch of synthetic supplements. I believe in supplements, but I believe in natural plant-derived supplements, not in the synthetic kind. There's a lot of chemicals in these supplements, especially over-the-counter, store-bought, you go to Walmart to buy your Flintstone vitamins for your kid or the chewable gummies. They are solvents.

Jodie Meschuk (1:58:07.123)

Yes, I call it expensive pee. It's toxicity, but also, if the body is not actually absorbing things, even if somebody is using a good quality supplement, it can just end up being expensive pee. So we have to work on those core basics of gut health. Especially when you're looking at children across the board, that root cause is that their gut is just simply unable to absorb nutrients. So we have to work on that for sure.

Ashley James (1:58:39.259)

Well, that'd be utilizing the nutrients. If it was in their pee, they absorbed it. They absorbed it in the gut. It bathed their body, but it didn't maybe necessarily get utilized because there need to be the cofactors in the right ratios. A lot of times these vitamin companies, the store-bought vitamin companies, they're high dose, but they're not in the right ratios, and they're not dosed by body weight.

I believe in supplements. Supplements really helped me, but the thing is, supplements are the mortar, not the bricks. So if you're going to go build a house, like build your body, like you're building a house, and the only thing you have is mortar, you're not building a house. The bricks are your diet.

Every day your body shows up, the carpenters show up to the work site to build the house because we are always breaking down. From the moment we were conceived, our body is building up and being broken down at the same time. Our goal is to help our body build up more than it's breaking down. But our lifestyle has been breaking our body down more than it's able to build up. The carpenters show up every day to rebuild and build your body. If you're feeding it frickin' McDonald's nuggets, the carpenters are there, but none of the building materials showed up to the site. So they're like, well, I don't have all the materials to build the house.

Simply put, we have to clean up our diet so that every day we bring all the materials for the carpenters to build the house, especially for your child. The thing is, we get emotionally attached to food, and there's definitely food addiction, and it's like alcoholism. If you were to tell your friends you're stopping drinking, how many of your friends would be angry or offended? The people who are angry or offended that you're stopping drinking, those are the alcoholics.

Same with food. If you told your in-laws or told your friends and family that you're no longer feeding cow dairy to your children, for example, or you're no longer feeding ice cream or sugar or McNuggets to your kids, the friends and family that get angry might come across as concerned or belittling. “Your kids need dairy, they need that. That's unhealthy to take that away” or “They're not going to have a normal childhood. What do you mean they're not giving them sugar? That's not a normal childhood.”

Those people who are defending processed food have food addiction, just like the alcoholic got offended when you said you're going to quit drinking. So that's about them and their food addiction. They don't have a nutrition degree. 

Jodie Meschuk (2:01:22.972)

Well, most nutritionists are trained by the system and they're still following the food pyramid. So that's a whole other issue.

Ashley James (2:01:28.308)

I went to a nutritionist once. It was sort of down the hallway from my OBGYN. This is when I was pregnant with my son. I'm okay, fine, whatever. It's paid by insurance. I'll go entertain this idea. I sit down and I go, I don't eat any processed food. I eat all organic. She proceeds to pull out a pamphlet of how I can eat healthy at McDonald's. I'm looking at her.

I'm gluten-free, I'm oil-free, I eat all organic food. She did not comprehend how to guide someone how to eat. She couldn't improve what I was doing because she wanted me to eat at McDonald's. So point being, when you start to change your child's diet, you have to bust through your own negative beliefs or belief system.

But then you're going to deal with the world out there that is going to be angry because you're triggering their addiction.

Jodie Meschuk (2:02:34.320)

Yes, I'm so glad you brought that up because the one thing that I do want to let parents out there know is, they may have already experienced this and we experienced it, is you get the backlash from people who should be by your side. The family, the close friends, the ones that just don't understand. What I find is it's oftentimes it's either with food. So if you are like, hey, mom and dad,

Grandma and grandpa, from now on, this is all my child can have. What do you normally get back? No, they're my grandbaby. No, of course, I'm going to spoil them. It was just a little sugar. It was just a little gluten. It was just a little goldfish crackers. It's not having that understanding of, no, no, no, this is actually really important. We're trying to heal. There can be none of that.

Some of it is they just don't understand because they're not down that rabbit hole that you might be, and they don't take it seriously. You're taking it seriously. But I find that the worst is when all of a sudden you stop vaccinating and then all hell breaks loose. Because if they think totally differently and they are still so bought into the system and they fear illness, they don't understand terrain, they just don't get it. 

It's really hard. What I'm saying. You have to be prepared for that, and you have to stand your ground, and you have to take a step back and just go, what? That's fine. If you want to get that COVID shot, obviously don't come around me anytime soon if you're going to get that, but that's not what we're doing. I need you to respect what I'm doing for my child. 

It's learning how to use your voice. It's learning how to stand in your power. So I think what is missed most in this conversation of healing children is there's the practical, which is, okay, Jodi, just tell me what to do and what supplements to give them. Great, I can do that all day long. But if you are not willing to move through that emotional stuff and get stronger and more confident and really work through that shame and guilt, it's going to be a lot harder. Because then what happens when grandma's like, I just gave them some goldfish, they'll be fine. We have to really be respectful, but it's, no, these are our boundaries. This is what we've decided for our child, and we need you to respect that. That's it, conversation over because it's my child.

Ashley James (2:05:24.802)

With enforcing boundaries, you don't have to enforce boundaries with emotion, anger, whatever, but there has to be a consequence. Otherwise, they're not boundaries. People will try to bulldoze your boundaries. That's the thing about boundaries is when you enforce them, the first thing people are going to do is, and I say people because children do it all the time, but adults do it too. They're going to test them. Not only will they test them, they will bulldoze straight over them. 

You have to show a consequence in a loving, respectful way. It's, hey, if you keep doing this, this is the consequence. So, hey, grandma, if you do this, if you keep doing it, you don't get to have unsupervised time with my children. You don't get to be with your grandchildren unsupervised if you keep feeding them something that hurts them. This is the consequence. You have to show me that I can trust you with my children.

Jodie Meschuk (2:06:17.338)

It sounds really harsh. Again, there's people. It's worth it though.

Ashley James (2:06:25.344)

It's worth it though. It is worth it because you will have a child come out on the other side healed. That is worth it. That is worth fighting for.  Sure people are going to be angry, but what? Those are their emotions, not yours. They need to own their own emotions. You're being loving and you're being the mama bear or the bear dad or whatever the dad version of mama bear is. You're being the protection for this child. 

I think what's the hardest part is the beginning. But when you get momentum, when you start to see all of a sudden your kid stops rocking or starts looking in the eye or starts talking again, when you start to see that they're out of pain, a neurological pain, it's the lights come on again and they start connecting with the world. That is going to motivate you to be stronger, to keep fighting; but in the beginning, you don't have any evidence that your choices are right. So you have to look at other people's stories—like your story.

Jodie Meschuk (2:07:23.686)

Yes, and you know what? We went through a lot of that with relationships and I always just came back to, get one shot at this and this is so important to me and this is my child, that this is the way it's going to be. There's no, again, you're saying, it's my boundary and I need you to respect that and you may not agree with me, but it was interesting too because some of the people in my life at the time who I would say I was most closest to, they were very skeptical at the beginning, which I understand, because somebody who doesn't know is going to be skeptical. Somebody who has only learned one train of thought their whole life is going to be skeptical. Somebody who Googles is going to be skeptical because they're just going to Google information that is highly censored and crafted. 

But it's interesting because as we got about a year and a half into our healing program and my child started speaking and eye contact and they started to see these changes. Now, I will say it was harder for me to see the changes because I was in it. It's always harder for the mother because you're so close to it. So it was really cool that some of these people would say things to me like, my gosh, Jodi, they are so different from when I saw them last. I cannot believe it. What are you doing?

That is just the ultimate compliment and the ultimate affirmation that a mother needs to keep going. You may not get that. I will say there's going to be people listening to your podcast. You may not have a supportive family. You may not ever experience that. You need to continue to push through because it is your child and we get one shot at it. But it was kind of cool. They came around after seeing what I was doing and they became believers.

Now guess what? Some of those people, now they don't vaccinate. They didn't get the COVID shot. They didn't fall for it. So that impact we can have on other people through our own story, we don't always have to verbalize it, but there's people watching. The family members, they're watching and seeing the improvements. It's something where you never know that impact that it can have on them.

Ashley James (2:09:37.260)

I love it. I lost really close friends who got the COVID shot. One of my best friends died of it. I have a friend, she's so intelligent. She's a lawyer, really, really intelligent people fell for the hoax, really intelligent. She gave her daughter the COVID shot and her daughter spent a month at Children's Hospital seizing more than 30 times a day, just having these horrible seizures, brain-damaging seizures. They would not admit it. The top pediatric neurologist in Washington state would not admit that it was due to the vaccine and that she's vaccine injured. There's just, these things happen sometimes. She, well, she didn't have epilepsy before.

She traveled America, going to several other top hospitals for this. None of them had answers other than more drugs. But none of them, actually, I had to say to her, this was vaccine injury because no doctor would admit it. I had to show her what VAERS was. She didn't know what the vaccine adverse events reporting system was. She didn't know about that. Most families don't. We've seen so many kids, so many teenagers die of the COVID shot and they're still pushing it. I'm so looking forward to the next few years and seeing the changes. We're going to see positive changes and hopefully, cognitive dissonance. I still feel that people, there'll be some people who believe the old ways and this is why it's like we need to think for ourselves. We need to really look, dive down and look at the facts. I did two interviews with Dr. Paul Thomas and I definitely recommend listeners go check that out. Go to learntruehealth.com. You could type in vaccines and listen to all the different episodes. I have over 500 episodes, but I probably have 20 where we're specifically talking about vaccines, detoxification and supporting the body and other professionals who help children in one way or another heal. 

Dr. Paul Thomas is a pediatrician who has clear, clear evidence that vaccines actually damage 100% of children. It's not always autism. That's the question, why? 

Do you have a good explanation? Again, this is such a deep, we could spend hours and hours, we could spend multi-day unpacking this, because you love to simplify things to help people really begin to grok it. Do you have an explanation as to why? Why do vaccines affect different children in different ways? I understand that everyone's at a different nutrient level. Of course, there's genetics. But there's also nutrition, there's also what stressors the baby was under in the womb or whatever, nutrients. But is there a clear way of understanding why one in whatever, what, 32 kids or something get autism, but other kids get asthma, peanut allergies, eczema, psoriasis, ADHD? There's all these different issues that come up.

Now, because of vaccines, we see a huge rise in autoimmune issues in children. Then we put them on, and this is what Dr. Paul Thomas said, which just blew my mind. He goes, so you give people, you give babies and children something that ramps up and kind of hyper, makes their immune system hyper-reactive. Then we put them on something that suppresses the immune system to calm it down. Then we develop childhood cancers. It's like the system gets to triple dip.

They get to make money from the vaccines. They get to make money from the steroids and then they get to make money from the cancer treatments for children. Of course, this is standard of care. The standard of care makes the pharmaceutical industry more money and the CDC makes money from vaccines. How is it ethical that the government agency that's supposed to oversee our health is profiting from pushing the thing that's causing us to be sick? Give us the idea, why is it that not everyone has sort of the same side effects from vaccines? Why do we have different ones?

Jodie Meschuk (2:14:39.516)

Well, your first thing is any vaccine is basically playing Russian roulette. So it's really important that parents understand it's like a poke and pray. I call it a poke and pray. We can't poke and pray. Literally, you're playing Russian roulette. So to lead up to it, it's like, are there different things that happen with different kids? Because it's Russian roulette and you don't know. So a lot of it to me and what I see, comes down to how adept their body is at clearing things out, how open their detox pathways are, how robust their terrain is in the very beginning, how adept their immune system is in spurring into action.

I think when you're looking at the different vaccines, there are a lot of factors at play because you could have people who follow the schedule completely. I know kids who technically have followed the schedule, they've gotten everything and they seem healthy, but are they really healthy? I think that's just it. When you look under the hood to Dr. Thomas's, what he was saying, which I agree with, there's actually, 100% of the people out there who have received vaccines that have a side effect inside of them. They just may not know it right away. So there's a reaction to every vaccine. It's just when is it going to show up and how is it going to show up? Sometimes it doesn't show up until years later. Sometimes it does show up earlier. Sometimes these kids have immediate regression and you see it immediately and they're gone, just from one set of vaccines. Sometimes it's eczema.

So you look at just how the human body is made and it's like, how do we answer the question of why some people live to be 120 and they have a garbage diet and why some don't? They have a garbage diet or they eat healthy. You could take somebody who is a health nut, wheatgrass drink, yogi, all the things, and they are more sick than somebody who eats garbage, and treats their body poorly and they drink and all the things. At the end of the day though, if you look under the hood, there are certainly things happening, but are they apparent enough for somebody to be able to connect the dots? Then also I think something that we don't look at is we don't look at emotions and emotional trauma enough. That really does play a role. Somebody might say, well, how does emotional trauma play a role in a baby? Well, it does because they're a product of their environment.

Ashley James (2:17:21.816)

Well, but also we've seen genetically emotional trauma passed down five generations that they can actually detect trauma in the descendants of those who were in Auschwitz and survived or those during the Holocaust. They've done this in mice studies where they traumatized mice to be afraid of this certain scent. Then they would breed them with mice that had never been hurt when they smelled this scent, it took five generations of diluting it 50% each time before the fifth generation was—the sixth generation is no longer afraid of that scent. We can see it in humans too, that there is an amount of emotional memory that holds onto trauma. We have to heal generational trauma. So that baby could be sort of, their baseline stress levels are higher.

Jodie Meschuk (02:10:11.552)

Absolutely, and that's why when you think about how there are some kids that display these symptoms of autism, now again, I want everyone to go back to what we talked about in the beginning. Stop calling it autism, call the symptoms for what they are. That alone would change the landscape of how we look at things if we just called things for the symptoms that they are versus labeling them autism or a diagnosis. But think about what kind of emotional health the mother had.

If they are carrying a bunch of generational trauma, if they themselves are dealing with emotional trauma or self-regulation issues or any of that, that is going to impact the baby. So now again, maybe that baby is born into an environment where maybe they don't receive any vaccines, but there's still that emotional trauma there. So their body is not going to respond in the same way to things that a child who isn't exposed to that would.

I laughed in 2020 when you had all of your health nuts, like the vegan community. They were the first to line up for the COVID vax. I mean, it was mind-blowing to me because you're supposed to be healthy and into all of that. But to my point though, you can take somebody who supposedly does all the right things and they end up getting breast cancer and dying. There's an emotional root to that. That's not talked about enough and mainstream medicine won't talk about that because you can't see that under a microscope necessarily.

Ashley James (2:20:07.362)

Well, Dr. Hammer proved it. Dr. Hammer, a German doctor, did over 30,000 case studies and proved the root of cancer and other illnesses was in trauma. He proved it, and they call it German New Medicine or Meta Medicine, but it's worth looking into. Yes, so that's Dr. Hammer, Dr. Hammer's work. It's worth looking into because we have to understand, we don't live in a meat sack.

God gave us this amazing temple we live in. We want to take care of our temple, but it's not just physical because when we look at quantum physics, every atom, every molecule is both a particle and a wave. So we are both frequency and matter. Inside of us, we have our emotional body, mental body, spiritual body, energetic body, and physical body. If we're just looking at physical, you're missing four other parts of your body, like four other layers of your body.

So you're saying that understanding why certain toxins affect others. I know a man who's an ex-husband of my friend and a good friend of mine. He is breathing alcohol. I have never seen someone drink this much alcohol. He wakes up at seven in the morning, cracks open a beer. I have never seen him sober. He is drunk. He drives drunk. He drives his kids drunk in the car. He is always drunk.

He looks so healthy. This is what drives me crazy. He never gets sick. All he eats is garbage. Apparently, he is super healthy. He is not mentally healthy. No. Emotionally healthy. No. He is incredibly unhealthy mentally and emotionally. But physically, all he does every day is drink alcohol. He hasn't drank water. He just drinks alcohol every day.

It's going to catch up to him eventually, but the thing is, if I drink even one beer, I would feel so gross. I can't do that. It's a blessing that I have more of a sensitive constitution because I take care of myself.

Jodie Meschuk (2:22:16.974)

I think also there is this piece of it, which is that there's a lot of people out there, and you could even say with kids too, because of this epidemic rise of illness and labels and all these things in children. 50% of children have some type of chronic illness today. People have been so used to how they feel, they think that's normal.

For us, I remember what I felt like before I changed my lifestyle and before I started learning about things. I thought I was healthy, but I was inflamed. I was sick all the time. I'd get strep throat. But again, what does culture want you to believe? That's normal. It's normal. It's just common. Everyone's getting sick, strep throat all the time. It's just normal. It's because it's common.

So you start to believe that, and then you don't realize that you're actually very sick until you start to change and you detox. Now I'm the same as you. If I have one sip of alcohol, which I don't drink at all, if I have one sip, I feel absolutely horrific. But that's not how I felt when I was in my early 20s. I thought that health felt normal, to feel yucky all the time.

I think you have a lot of people that are in that position where they just think that that's how health feels because they have no idea what it feels like to really be healthy.

Ashley James (2:23:44.450)

Health is symptom-free, and health is also how quickly you bounce back from a stressor, from an injury or illness, or from a more stressful event like running a marathon or something. Health is how quickly you bounce back, but also, day to day, you should have no symptoms. You should wake up, bounce out of bed, immediately feel energy, and have a good amount of hunger.

You should be able to have sustained, healthy energy and mental clarity through the whole day. Then you should feel tired at night, go to bed, and fall asleep within 20 minutes of lying down. You should not wake up in the night to pee. You should be able to go four hours between each meal. You should have three bowel movements a day. You should not have headaches.

If that doesn't sound like you, then you don't have health. That is what we all should work towards. That is what health looks like.

Jodie Meschuk (2:24:34.398)

Yes, apply that to kids nowadays. I mean, again, you have the kids with the chronic ear infections. It's normal. Now get your tonsils and adenoids out. That'll fix it.

Ashley James (2:24:43.674)

It is not. It is not. I rage against this. This is when I hear that it's normal for a child to be sick. It infuriates me more because I've got that mama bear. I want to protect these children. I want to help the parents understand that having your child go for major surgery, they have to be put under. I know a 12-year-old that died. Died. It is a needless death. It's so sad because she died of the anesthesia.

Most of the time just removing cow dairy from their diet stops the infections. That's one of the big things. Obviously, remove sugar, processed sugar, but cow dairy is another big cause. Before the doctor recommended major surgery for your child, why didn't the doctor recommend any dietary intervention first, which we've known is proven that cutting out sugar and cow dairy is 90% of the time or more decreases or eliminates those chronic infections?

Jodie Meschuk (2:25:42.610)

Exactly. Yes. So I guess the answer to your question is, I firmly believe every vaccine causes damage in the body. When that shows up and how that shows up is going to be dependent on a wide variety of factors. But you can't discount how emotions play into it, how energy plays into it, all of that stuff too. So I think there's a ton of kids walking around with vaccine damage.

It may not show up in a full-blown neurological problem, but just go around and start looking at kids' mouths. If you see a little droopy side on the mouth, that's a vaccine injury. You have a ton of kids walking around with that. It's part of a vaccine reaction. It's a nerve reaction. It's called a crooked mouth. You just literally go people-watch and look for people with crooked mouths. That's a vaccine injury.

It's insane the amount of people and then, well, the amount of kids too. But yes, even the little things. Guess what? If your child receives a vaccine, a week later, two weeks later, maybe three weeks later, they have an ear infection. That's actually a vaccine reaction. But we're not connecting the dots because they don't allow you to connect the dots.

Ashley James (2:27:04.946)

Yes. Thank you so much for coming on the show. I mean, I just want to have you here for hours and hours. This was so wonderful.

Jodie Meschuk (2:27:15.282)

It was, I mean, it's three hours. It's awesome. We were having so much fun. Two and a half hours.

Ashley James (2:27:20.818)

Yes, this is so great. I definitely want you to come back. So you're right now revising your book and you're going to publish it soon. Come back? Please, please, please come back. I'd love to continue to go down this rabbit hole. There's so much to talk about. But I love what we covered today. See, I never know what we're going to actually cover. This is just that wonderful weave of the conversation that we get to have. But what I really do feel that there's divine intervention. I really feel God guides us and guides me in my questions and guides us in our conversation to reach the people that need to hear this, the answer to our prayers, because God uses us. 

God uses all of us to answer the prayers of other people. So be willing to sort of follow that little nudge when you get it and to speak up, because sometimes God's asking you to speak up to help. I've had that experience where it's like, no, go talk to that person. I get this hit, go. You have this message to deliver to this person, go do it. Don't let yourself be a coward, go do it. So if you see someone who's about to go vaccinate their kids, expose them to this information. The worst that can happen is they get upset at you, big deal. No one got hurt really. But the best thing is that you could be actually helping them protect their kids.

What we covered here today was the mindset piece of going into helping your child heal after they've been vaccine injured, which is everyone who's received a vaccine. But going in to help your child, have that courage to make the changes, to go down this rabbit hole, to make the diet changes, to clean up the environment of the house, to help your child support their brain and stop being on fire, bring down the inflammation, help them detox the heavy metals.

Help them heal their gut because there's known gut dysbiosis that happens with vaccines and often people who follow the traditional route of getting vaccines also have had a lot of antibiotics. So we definitely have dysbiosis, but helping their child be healthier. Along the path, the first steps are the hardest because you're making new neural connections. You're also having to establish boundaries, but it is so worth it.

You will be encouraged by the health you see reflected in your child as they get brighter and brighter and healthier and healthier and more vibrant and they feel better, and you will be rewarded by that. So it is worth doing. I definitely recommend going to Jodie Meschuk's website, which is thewarriorcenter.com and checking out her books. Then of course, we're definitely going to want to have you back when your latest book gets published.

Jodie Meschuk (2:30:14.206)

Thank you so much. This was such fun. I just love getting this information out there. You summarized it perfectly. I mean, I just have such a heart and a passion for helping parents to see that there's another way and literally saving one baby at a time, literally saving one baby at a time. It's worth it.

Ashley James (2:30:33.812)

It's so worth it. It's so worth it, those children, I'm sure it's such a moving experience when you get to help the parents help their children and then get to see the outcome. I've had that in a lesser extent. I've helped a few friends help their children detox and I've watched the children begin to speak clearly again, just the lights come back on.

It is so rewarding and it's so worth it. So yes, just fight the fight, help your children to be healthy. Follow Jodie to learn more about what you can do. Of course, you can also, I said, type in autism in learntruehealth.com and you'll see all the episodes come up and listen to my episode 385 about the GAPS diet and listen to the Paul Thomas episode and follow Jodie and listen to all her stuff too, because there's answers out there, but the answers won't be found in the mainstream media. It will be found at your doctor's office unless you're seeking a holistic doctor. So that's why you have to do your own research and you have to do your own digging.

Jodie Meschuk (2:31:45.894)

Amen to that. 

Ashley James (2:31:47.700)

Yes, thank you so much for coming on the show. This was great.

Jodie Meschuk (2:31:50.140)

You’re welcome.

Outro:

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